Haul data, collection / Haul errors

Walter & Group.........

Please let me know if you have not been able to open the attachments I have been sending.

Gordy

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Followup message from Bruce Richards on the methods used to obtain the graphs :-

 

We collected data from the rate gyro, haul sensor, and strain guage all at

the same time, but had to adjust the offsets to get them all to read with

the same zero. Not my area of expertise, Noel did it so I can't give much

technical detail.... No time shifting was needed, of course.

You can see that peak rod angular speed and max rod flex coincide very

nicely. The haul continues for a short time after that point but does not

exactly coincide with RSP, which would be where the flex curve meets the

centerline. We aren't sure if that is due to some sort of minor measurement

error, or if that is what I actually did. Both Noel and I feel that the

optimum haul ends right at RSP, but more study is needed to fully

understand this.

Bruce

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From Gary Eaton on haul errors:-

Gordy,

 Scott Swartz asked about common errors -

The most prolific error I see is appearance of slack between line hand and stripping guide.
Also on the list - bad line management with loose line wrapped around everything from hook keeper to rod butt.

 - haul timing errors are abundant but mostly ending too soon. Another error seen here that is really a shooting release error and not so much a hauling error, is the too long a delay in initiating the shoot (holding it too long).

When my better intermediate casters need help it is from trying to do too much. They introduce body twist and get lazy about getting the hands back close together preparing for the hauls or they try to change the haul pace to directly add line speed by hauling really fast. Often they cannot keep this up for a sequence of false casts.

I also see casters lose their connection between rod and line hands - they concentrate on the rod and have weak, ineffective haul or they focus on the haul and bring the rod tip in an arc (start rotating too early and never effectively STOP).

I think I have seen the most horrific, confidence shattering melt-downs in double-haul classes. Some have been so complex as to defy complete analysis. I get them right back on the horse and build smooth, controlled haul basics solidly as immediately as I can.

 

One of my instructing nightmares is the guy who has been casting for a long time who wants to suddenly learn to double haul. Usually, their basic casting stroke is so flawed that we are truly up against Lefty Kreh's  description "...throw their mistakes farther." I tend to have them work on a one-hand shoot until they have a tight back cast loop and good timing before doing any part of the haul. This is probably where I work the cheapest and give away more teaching time.

 

Gary Eaton

 

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Gary ....

 

OK ... let me try to distill this down.  So far we have :

 

1. Introducing slack between the line hand and the stripper guide, 

2. Haul timing errors,  

3. Haul release (shooting) timing error, (releasing too early or too late.) 

4. Loss of connection between rod and line hands, 

5. Hauling too fast,     

6. Weak, ineffective hauls, 

7. Using the haul primarily to take up slack (really a faulty basic cast.) , and

8. Not getting the hands back together in time (really another timing problem).  Also,

9. Concentrating on the haul to the detriment of the basic cast. 

        I suspect that most bad line management problems with loose line wrapping around is a manifestation of intruducing slack.... if so, this would be covered in, "1."  Pulling line across the base of the reel, however, would be another error altogether.  Perhaps we could call that,

10. Error of direction of haul.

 

Gordy

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From Michael Jones:-

 

To Scott's question: "what everyone sees as the most common mistakes

when observing students hauling."

My observation is that the average DH'er typically:

1. uses 'too much' pull of the line hand (haul) too early during the

casting stroke. This applies 'too much' deep bending to the rod, too

early, leading to errant loop formation.

2. is having so much fun with their new skill that they compensate

for #1 by reducing rotational input from the casting hand, which

removes the deep bending, allows the caster to clean up the loop

shape, but not effectively combine good rotation & hauling

simultaneously to ultimately accomplish 'wicked fast & tight loops'.

3. makes too long a casting stroke for the amount of line being cast,

why? Because they are used to making a specific casting stroke for a

specific line length BH (before learning to haul), and through the

process, end up in #1ville & #2ville.

If hauling increases line speed, it follows that it should increase

efficiency, and therefor a cast of 50' should require a shorter

casting stroke when proper hauling is applied.

Michael Jones

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Michael ...    OK ... now this adds :  11. Inappropriate application of haul hand power,12. Lack of needed rod rotation with poor coordination of rod arc with haul and  13. Failure to adjust the stroke length to the haul.

Gordy

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One last answer I thought I'd share, from Walter Simberski to the question on the leader, line, fly rod and bull whip:

Gordy - Besides taper there is another point of similarity between a bull whip and the rod/line/leader system.

 

They both have a means of dissipating energy to prevent damage to the body of the whip or the line. On the bull whip this

is the short piece of thin leather at the end of the whip called the "fall". Other types of whips may have a loop of leather or

a group of short leather thongs. On the rod/line/leader system the leader dissipates some of the energy but we add

a bit of yarn or a fly for more complete dissipation.

 

Cheers

 

Walter

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