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  • CONGRATULATIONS ! / More answers to quiz / Thumb position



    Walter & Group...

    Congratulations to Bill Whitebread for passing the Masters exam !

    Gordy,

     Just to let you know, I passed my MCI Test on Saturday at the FFF SE Council Conclave in Helen, GA.

     Information I received from your site was helpful along with the help I received from Pat Damico, who spent many days with me while he and I ran each other through the MCI test. 

     I would like to also thank David Diaz, John Hand, and Ed Chamberlain for taking the time to test me.

     Thanks everyone,

     Bill Whitebread

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    Answers from Mark Surtees.  I picked his answers, today, because they come closest to my own.  Take note of his answers to questions 1.) and 3.) .  So far, Mark is the only respondant to answer these two questions this way.   G. :

    Hi Gordy

     I?ve been away so I?m a bit late for the party?.

     Mark

     

     

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    1.)    Would you use the term ACCELERATION as you teach a class of beginning students ?

    No, the term seems to be almost always interpreted as ?more power? by beginners and I would like them to use as little power as possible

    2.)  If you answered, yes, briefly tell us how.

    3.)  You have two advanced fly casting students who wish to improve with respect to distance and accuracy.  Would you use the term ACCELERATION in teaching these students ?

    I might if there were serious issues with improper power application but generally I would try to avoid it for the same reasons above.

    4.)  If you answered ,yes, tell us what word picture you would paint.

    5.)  When teaching, is there ever a time when you would introduce the concept of EFFECTIVE ROD LENGTH ?

    As a teaching term, not so far.

    6.)  How would you do that ?

    7.)  Your beginner student has just learned what a loop is and how to make it.  Would you go into the mechanics of how and when the loop forms with her ?

    No

    8.)  If so, how would you do that ?

    9.)  You are coaching a very accomplished fly caster who wants to pass the CCI exam.  As you discuss loop formation, he asks you when the loop actually forms.  What do you tell him ?

    For a CCI exam it should be sufficient to say that it forms when the line begins to pass the rod tip. However, should the examiner require more, the candidate could explain that the beginning of loop formation is at RSP as counterflex pulls the line below the pre RSP tip path, only at maximum counterflex does the line really begin to pass the rod tip.

    10.)  This CCI candidate wants you to teach him more about application of power in order to make an efficient cast.  How do you handle that ?

    I would look to demonstrate how little power is needed to make an ?efficient cast? at normal fishing distances by asking for smooth, low power side casts along a tape so that the line does not fully extend. I would try to demonstrate the effect of improper application of power using tailing loops and the effect of improper reduction in power by failing to stop correctly.

    11.)  At what level (if ever) might you introduce the concept of matching rod bend to the casting arc ?

    At an intermediate level normally, the point when we introduce a change of speed, hauling or increasing the length of line to be cast.

    12.)  Your "intermediate" level student has been fly casting for years.  He can cast about 60 feet, but his layout is a mess. You have determined that this is mainly because of inaproppriate application of power.  What words would you choose to help him correct that ?

    I would tell them what I believed the problem to be and explain the exercises that we can do to correct it. I like to use ?smooth?, ?fluid?, ?rhythm? ?calm? if the issue is too much power and harsher words like ?stop? ?block? ?check? if they have lost their stops. If its both then ?Sssssssssslick? is cool?. J

    13.)  As you tackle the problem in 12.), What physical means (if any) would you employ ?

    I use the same exercises that I would use in 10 above and demo the effect of poor stops in the cast if that were the problem.

    14.)  This student is an advanced caster who wishes to improve his overall casting.  He is a graduate mechanical engineer.  As you try to improve his loop formation and timing, would you use terms and concepts that you might not use with another student who is a high school history teacher ?   Briefly explain.

    No I wouldn?t, the tems and concepts that we use should be simple to explain and understand and appropriate for any student within the context of a casting lesson. Sadly, on the one occasion when I have not followed this principle I confused the sh*t out of my student and it was a pretty poor lesson as a consequence.

    15.)  Do you ever use a Casting Analyzer as you teach fly casting ?

    No

    16.)  When (if ever) ?

    17.)  How ?

    18.)  Do you ever use video as you teach ?

    No

    19.)  When ?

    20. )  How ?

    21.)  You have students at 4 levels.  Each wants to know how to make the smallest loop possible.  How do you do that with ? :

             a.  An early student who has been casting for only one day.

    I explain and demonstrate slp and use practice routines with short lines, side casting up and down a tape.

             b.  An "intermediate" student who has been fly fishing for years and can cast about 50' with big loops.

    Pretty much the same.

             c.  A more advanced student who can cast 70 feet or so while using much more effort than necessary.

    I go back to using the exercises outlined in 10 above, these can be used just as effectively with a haul, that is try to reduce power so that the hauled cast doesn?t fully extend.   

             d.  A CCI who can make 80' distance.  This fellow wants to be a Master candidate.  His loops are not consistently good.  He gets an occasional tail as he tries to form a tight loop.

    Same as above.

    22.)  Do you think it is possible to teach fly casting to students at all levels without using any scientific or physics terms ?

    Not to all levels no, but, even when we do use such terms, they are very few and usually quite easy concepts to manage.

    23.)  Why do you think that we ask our Master candidates to have some basic knowledge of the physics involved in fly casting ?

    Because we have to understand how the tools that we use to cast actually work. I believe that we should have a basic knowledge of bio-mechanics too and a good understanding of the psychology involved in both teaching and learning.

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    Tony Loader makes this comment with respect to question 5.) (On effective rod length) :-

    Hi Gordy,
     
    Welcome back.
     
    While reviewing the quiz answers below it occurred to me that while I sometimes mention Effective Rod Length when demonstrating rod bend vs angle change to maintain SLP, I always mention it in relation to desirable rod angles and the mechanical disadvantage of a class one lever when fighting and landing a fish.
     
    Regards,
    Tony.
     
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    Tony....   Now your student asks, "What the heck is a class one lever ?"    What do you do, now ?    Gordy
     
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    Dan Davala comments on Walter Simbirski's messsage on Effective Rod Length :
     
    (Walter wrote,
    "While I like the term "effective rod length" to describe the dynamic nature of the rod during casting,
    Phillips was ahead of us in using the term for a different purpose. I suggest we find another term for
    the phenomenon that allows us to follow slp - something along the lines of effective chord length or
    dynamic rod length. " )
     
    I couldn't agree more with Walter!  I like the term "Dynamic Rod Length" to describe the "phenomenon".  If we don't stick with established definitions,  then a question that pertains to "effective rod length" during a MCI test would be too subjective depending on which definition the examiner(s) prefers or agrees with.  I suppose for this reason it is best to be able to answer either way, with short answers of course!
     
    Dan Davala  
     
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                                                      LEFTY'S ANSWER TO LOU BRUNO ON THUMB POSITION
     
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    Gordy-Lou,
    I think it is important and teach that you begin either a back or a foward cast with the thumb behind the rod handle from the target. If the wrist is not twisted during the cast all of the energy is directed away from or back to the target.
    The illustration as well as the text in the book is incorrect. I don't recall how many years ago I wrote this--but it is interesting that only Lou has picked this up. 
     
    Lefty
     
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