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  • "Ticking" / Controlling back cast length / Leader-line connection



    Walter & Group...

    From Ally Gowans on "ticking", with some interesting history added :-

    Hi Gordy,

     

    You sure know how to stop your line “ticking” but your brain is thankfully running like clockwork so there is no cause for alarm! This surely must be the most informed fly casting group on Earth!

     

    Ticking - great dissertation – not something that I had thought about much but now that you mention it ------

     

    There is another contributory factor to ticking - the line mass distribution. The line profile greatly influences susceptibility to “tick”. Imagine the location of the centre of gravity of an extended fly line. In the case of a shooting head the centre of gravity is towards the extremity of the line and therefore its susceptibility to “tick” is high. (We know how difficult it is to keep a shooting head off the ground with a quantity of running line in the air and especially so if the front taper is short or non existent). At the other extreme imagine a continuously tapered fly line – the nearest we might get to that is the triangle taper, here the centre of gravity is much closer to the rod tip and it gets some support from the tip ring and at the far end the light line dissipates energy well due to its small mass and so has much less tendency to kick downwards. The converse of “tickability” might be “shootability” because if the centre of gravity is towards the end of the line a comparatively large amount of energy can be retained in this fast travelling section and therefore it has the potential to shoot further.

     

    It’s comforting to know that the history of our great sport often reinforces our considerations. Quote below from “An Angler’s Cast” (Cpt. T L Edwards and E Horsfall Turner). Marvin Hedge was a great American fly caster who developed the “Hedge Balanced Taper Fly Line” a compound taper WF design from the 1930’s that is prevalent in many of today’s products. The line being discussed is of silk and the cast was overhead.

     

    In the Fishermen's Encyclopaedia, Marvin Hedge contributes the section on tournament lines. The following is an extract from his section:

    "On my first trip to the English International matches (1938) I was the guest of Capt. Tommy Edwards, the English Champion salmon caster of those days. Tommy took me out to his private lake, set up his salmon outfit, and made a few casts. Each cast was around the world record mark of those days, but most of them touched the ground on the back cast and in International matches such a cast is disqualified. If the fly, leader or line touches anything before the final forward cast-no score. When I mentioned this fact to Tommy he replied that he just couldn't hold the line up, and couldn't understand why. His line had a definite sag in it when it travelled through the air. After studying his casts I discovered that the sag was caused by an oversize section about 6 in. long and about 14 ft. from the front taper. His back taper was far too long. I dressed the oversize section down with steel wool and took 9 ft. out of his long back taper and he proceeded to make six casts of more than 40 ft. over the world record. . . all casts pulled out the shooting line and none touched anywhere. "

    This gives some idea of the importance of the weight factor in very small sections of line.

     

    The extract also gives some idea of the importance of good preparation i.e. potentially the best casts always result from a “perfect” form of back cast or D loop. In this case it appears that Edwards made better casts after reducing his back cast length.

     

    Best wishes,

    Ally Gowans

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    Ally...

    Marvin Hedge has also been credited with popularizing the double haul.  My grandfather knew him.  He may not have really invented it, for it seems unlikely that others hadn't already used it for their fishing.

    I don't recall our using any modern type pvc coated lines back in '38  (and I know PU hadn't been invented).

    Controlling the length of the back cast could very well be a detailed topic of value.

    As I've pointed out in the recent past, a frequent fault exhibited by budding distance casters lies in their carrying increased amounts of line out of the rod tip until they get a bit more out there than they can handle well.  The next delivery cast suffers and distance isn't achieved.

    When casting with a strong wind from behind, among the many things the caster must do, I'd include shortening the length of the back cast  to minimize the tendency of the wind to blow it toward the caster as the loop unfurls.

    Gordy

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                                                               LEADER - LINE CONNECTIONS

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    Belated message from Steve Jacobs on leader butt section to fly line connections:-

    Gordy,

    I forgot to update your address so I am sending this as a reply since this bounced back to me
    Steve
    Gordy,
    I was in the Bahamas and just read the e mails on knots etc. I use a connection on my saltwater outfits 8-12 wts that was not mentioned. Lenny Moffo showed me this connection method. Attach the fly line to the leader butt with a 6 turn nail knot, THEN TIE A SIMPLE OVERHAND KNOT IN THE FLY LINE AND SNUG THE NAIL KNOT UP TO IT BEFORE TIGHTENING THE NAIL KNOT. Coat with Pliobond. I leave a permanent 5 ft leader butt with a loop knot on the end. Then I build 5-7 ft leaders and attach to the loop on the butt.
    This has worked well on everything including Tarpon. Don't know if it would work on billfish, tuna, etc.
    Steve

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    Steve,   I presume you mean to tie the overhand knot below (leaderward) of the nail knot.  If so, I suppose this would help prevent failure from the nail knot slipping down and off the fly line. (????) Does Lenny tie that overhand knot over the butt section ?  Having not done that, I can't claim experience with that method.  However, when 6 turn and 8 turn nail knots are the sole connection to the end of the fly line, I've had them fail on big game when fishing with heavy tippets as the coating pulls off the fly line core.  Perhaps Lenny's method would help prevent the latter.

    If the overhand knot is tied above the nail knot and the nail knot snugged up to it while tightening, I'd think that would drastically reduce the breaking strength (resistance) of the fly line itself to the point that it might well turn out to be less than that of the big game tippet.

    For years, before we started using loop to loop connections, we used a modification of the Albright special for this connection, especially for the early "slime lines" which had coatings which pulled off the core easily.  This method proved stronger in actual use than the simple nail knot connection, though a tad more bulky.

    Over the past few days, I've been playing with the connections described by Dan Blanton and introduced to us by Lefty.  On the bench, this is proving to be a very strong connection as well as the least bulky of any others we've tried.  The slickest one is one I made using 50# hollow braid Dacron Micron.  I am concerned, however, about the fact that Dacron is not very abrasion resistant.  Of course, my tensile strength testing wouldn't address that.

    One thing I tried is a drop of Super-glue at the upper end of the sleeve.  This yields a tiny stiff spot, however, and probably is overkill.  I've made the leaders up with 20 lb. test material which actually tests at close to 25 lb.s .... and have popped 10 tippets without budging one of these connections even when no glue is used.  I won't go higher, because the fly lines themselves are testing at anywhere from 28 #  to 35 # except for one which tested at 42 #.

    That permanent butt section does make things easier in many ways ..... but I do change butt section lengths for different fishing conditions.  For that reason, I prefer the loop-to-loop connections so far.

    Gordy

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