Long Beach Casting Club / ANSWERS TO QUIZ

Gordy,

    I am having a Snook Fly Fishing Tournament in June, through my fly shop. We have been looking for a charity to donate all proceeds to. I can't think of a better charity. So, if they will allow us, we will hold the charity, with all proceeds going to the Long Beach Club. We usually manage to raise about $500 at these events. But, we will try to raise as much as possible. Please let me know if this is ok and we will go forward with it.

   John Tarr
   The Fly Fisherman
   Titusville/Orlando, Florida

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OK !!! Brings me to thank you and our other Study Group members who are helping to rebuild the Long Beach Casting Club after its tragic fire.

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I. In your opinion, which is more important in determining the way a fly leader turns over ? List these in order of importance :-

All three are important. Bruce Richards points out that the mass profile of the leader may be the most important. Of course, this is part of the design of the leader. When considering the stiffness of the material, we must remember that we can have about the same stiffness or resistance to bending for material which is inherently stiff but of low diameter compared with soft material of greater diameter.

I like the concept of trying for smooth transfer of energy from the fly line loop to the leader by having the stiffness of the butt section of the leader about the same or a trifle less than that of the end of the fly line. This can be achieved with thin, stiff material or thicker more pliable material.

II. You are making up a leader for bonefishing. You are going to be using # 2 to #4 non weighted flies for tailing fish in shallow water. Would you prefer to use soft (pliable) or stiff material ? soft/pliable

For bones in medium depth, I prefer medium soft material. In shallow water, tailing fish may be very spooky, so a lighter splashdown is an advantage. In this scenario, I'd use stiffer material of lower diameter.

III. Your student asks you if he should use a tippet of fluorocarbon for dry fly fishing on a spring creek. What do you tell him ? not a good idea... FC sinks

IV. I'm going fishing for largemouth bass with poppers. What leader should I tie up ? 3' 30 TO 1'20 OR 3'40 TO 1' 30 DEPENDING ON SIZE OF POPPER

Agree. Even a super simple one piece short non tapered leader of 20lb. test would do. With these short non tapered or minimally tapered leaders, there is little dissipation of energy, so the popper splashes down hard gaining the attention of Mr. bass even if he is lurking way back under the lily pads.

V. What leader would you use while fishing king (Chinook) salmon in a 12' deep run in on an Alaskan river? You are using a sink tip Teeny line and a # 1 salmon streamer. 4'/3' FC 15/20lb

That'll work OK. I've never found that fluorocarbon was necessary, but it does sink better than nylon mono. My favorite for this scene is 2' of 30# mono followed by 1 1/2' of class tippet of 12# or 15# mono directly to the fly.

VI. What material does Lefty Kreh recommend for the butt section and tapered sections of most salt water leaders ? mono.

Yes. Medium soft/stiff. Ref: PRESENTING THE FLY, Lefty Kreh, pp. 44-52. (Lots of leader tips there !!!)

VII. How does the number sequence, "60-20-20" relate to fly leaders? proportion of butt to mid & tippet section

VIII. Name two advantages of fluorocarbon for leader construction. faster sink rate,abrasion resistant and lower refractive index.

Yes. The lower refractive index makes it less visible to the fish. Different brands of FC have different resistances to abrasion. Most brands of FC, however, have greater abrasion resistance than most brands of nylon mono.

IX. Name two disadvantages of fluorocarbon for leader construction. poor knot strength especially with mono & expensive.

Yes. Only certain knots work well when using FC, especially when connecting to nylon monofiliment.

XI. When might you want to use a butt section of stiff material which has a very thin diameter ? for delicate presentations.

Agree. With the same idea in mind, this stiff material will be much thinner with the same flexibility, so the thin material will be much easier to attach to a fly line when a needle knot is desired.

XII. What is a, "Harvey leader" ? multi part leader for delicate and S shape presentations for drag free drift.

Yes. Developed by George Harvey, this leader has a long multisegment tapered section designed to dissipate all the energy prior to full turnover of the leader loop. This results in a slack line layout.

XIII. What is a, "SHOCK TIPPET"? abrasive resistant end for toothy critters..could be wire or heavy mono/FC.

Yes. Usually about 12" long or less when the angler wishes to rig according to IGFA rules. This is placed between the classs tippet and the fly.

XIV. What desirable properties do you consider when choosing a material for the shock tippet when going for tarpon ? knot strength and abrasive resistance.

Well.... the knot strength of the connection between the shock tippet and the class tippet is a strong consideration. Abrasion and "tooth" resistance is a prime consideration. A third property is visability. Fourth is, "strike aversion" to some materials such as wire and cable.

XV. Name as many connections as you can for fastening the butt section of a leader to the end of the fly line. needle knot,nail knot,albright knot, loop to loop w/ whipped loop on flyline.

Yes. Could add an, "emergency" connection such as making an overhand knot in the end of the fly line, passing the butt section through it and making a uni knot behind the overhand knot, etc, etc.

XVI. What knots do you prefer when constructing a tapered section of your leader ? surgeons knot seated correctly.

Good for great strength, along with double nail knots and double uni knots. All of these, however, do end up being bulky. Of the three, the surgeons knot is most likely to pick up algae/weed, etc.

I prefer the blood knot even though it isn't as strong. When strength is important as when fishing salty critters, I still use blood knots for my tapered section, then place a uni loop at the end of the last tapered section. To this I make a loop-to-loop connection with my class tippet. (The weakest link in the system being the class tippet .... this is likely to break before the blood knots slip and come apart. It will break with even less stress if I place a blood knot in the class tippet section, so I avoid that.)

XVII. Name one disadvantage of using a commercial knotless tapered leader for trout fishing. expense,adding tippit.

Yes .... every time you tie on a new fly or break one off, you lose some of the leader. Lefty's tip is to cut some off after buying one and then adding your own class tippet.

Another disadvantage is that you may wish to change the taper to one not commercially available.... or at least one that you don't have with you. If you carry your own leader materials, you can construct a, "custom" leader in the field to meet the new demands.

XVIII. Your student is going fly fishing for a fish in Africa which has very big sharp teeth. He's been told to rig up some monofilament wire bite tippets. He wants to know how to attach the wire to the nylon leader. What do you teach him ? haywire twist.

The haywire twist is one good way to attach the wire to the fly. It can also be used on the other end of the wire for an Albright special ..... or you can simply bend the wire around and tie an Albright knot without the haywire loop.

XIX. I want to make well controlled accurately placed casts with a very delicate presentation. My plan is to use a very long, thin tapered leader attached to a long fine tapered tip section of my fly line. What do you think of my choice ? ...depending on priority..accuracy SHORTEN leader section...delicacy LENGTHEN tip section.

You have answered with generalities which often do work. Here, however, we have a combination of two energy dissipating arrangements in the same system ..... the very long thin tapered leader AND a long fine tapered tip section of the fly line. There will be so much loss of energy that the loops will not turn over well and the layout will not be well controlled. accuracy will be impossible. A very bad combination.

A better combination is the long, thin tapered leader attached to a standard forward tapered fly line. This way, you won't dissipate so much energy at the end of the cast that you lose control.

XX. What is a, "Bungee butt" ? shockgum to absorb energy of BIG trout hitting fly....from Nick Lyons "Spring Creek".

Gordy,

I'll play this one. See my answers below.

By the way... what ever happened with your challenge to throw 6' mends way out there? I tried it and wasn't able to do it, and have been waitng to see the response but I must have missed it.

Gary Meyer

First, my answer to those mends: Make the mend move HIGH and EARLY, right after the stop. Carry enough line, and then SHOOT THE WHOLE THING OUT TO THE TARGET. Helps to reduce tension between the mend and the rod tip by raising your rod hand and immediately point the rod at the target and thrust forward as you twist it almost 90degrees. This way, the tension is less likely to pull your mend out straight.

QUESTIONS:

I. In your opinion, which is more important in determining the way a fly leader turns over ? List these in order of importance :-

A.) The stiffness of the material.

B.) The design of the leader.

C.) The mass profile the leader

My answer: C, B, A

II. You are making up a leader for bonefishing. You are going to be using # 2 to #4 non weighted flies for tailing fish in shallow water. Would you prefer to use soft (pliable) or stiff material ?

Want a long leader with a gentle splash, probably be better with stiffer material because of reduced diameter.

III. Your student asks you if he should use a tippet of fluorocarbon for dry fly fishing on a spring creek. What do you tell him ?

Fluoro may be good to reduce visability, but it may also drag the fly under due to its higher density. High quality low vis mono may be a better option.

IV. I'm going fishing for largemouth bass with poppers. What leader should I tie up

Nothing real fancy, in fact a straight piece of level mono of about 10 – 12 # test will probably be OK.

V. What leader would you use while fishing king (Chinook) salmon in a 12' deep run in on an Alaskan river? You are using a sink tip Teeny line and a # 1 salmon streamer.

I’d try a relatively short (3 – 4’) of mono, strength depending on the size of the salmon.

VI. What material does Lefty Kreh recommend for the butt section and tapered sections of most salt water leaders ?

High quality regular mono, neither real stiff nor soft.

VII. How does the number sequence, "60-20-20" relate to fly leaders?

That’s the default percentage leader: butt, taper, tippet.

VIII. Name two advantages of fluorocarbon for leader construction.

Advantages: reduced visibility and greater sink rate.

IX. Name two disadvantages of fluorocarbon for leader construction.

Disadvantages: price and knot strength.

XI. When might you want to use a butt section of stiff material which has a very thin diameter ?

When a gentler presentation is desired.

XII. What is a, "Harvey leader" ?

A dry fly leader designed to just turn over the fly and yield plenty of slack in the presentation to reduce drag.

XIII. What is a, "SHOCK TIPPET"?

A short terminal piece of material to protect against abrasion.

XIV. What desirable properties do you consider when choosing a material for the shock tippet when going for tarpon ?

Maximum abrasion resistance against visibility depending upon the water clarity

XV. Name as many connections as you can for fastening the butt section of a leader to the end of the fly line.

Loop to loop; Albright knot; nail knot; needle knot; quick nail knot; emergency knots

XVI. What knots do you prefer when constructing a tapered section of your leader ?

Personally I prefer the blood knot, standard or improved

XVII. Name one disadvantage of using a commercial knotless tapered leader for trout fishing.

Lack of ability to customize for different conditions

XVIII. Your student is going fly fishing for a fish in Africa which has very big sharp teeth. He's been told to rig up some monofilament wire bite tippets. He wants to know how to attach the wire to the nylon leader. What do you teach him ?

The Albright knot

Probably will be tough to control, a compound concave taper on the line would probably be better..

XX. What is a, "Bungee butt" ?

Stretchy rubber material that acts as a shock absorber to protect fine tippets

Have fun with these questions !

Gordy