Roll cast concepts / I'm back

Walter & Group..........

From Troy Miller:-

I think of a roll cast in the way that the old wet fly fishermen did.  I think of it as a loop that "rolls" across the surface of the water, keeping the fly in the water for the longest possible time until the instant that it's lifted and laid back into the water at the target.  In my classes, I teach this.  I teach that there are different applications for different types of rolls.  I will purposely ask for a wet fly roll cast or an aerialized non-hauled roll cast (mid-range, tight loop), or an aerialized long-range hauled roll cast.  And none of those includes throwing line on the ground behind me, nor into a dynamic D-loop in the air behind me.  Personally, I consider those as their own genre of casts.  I'm not dogging them in any way, just don't like grouping them directly into the same category as my other roll casts...

 

I don't teach that the roll is what the rod tip is doing, but rather what the loop is doing.  Of course, those two are related, but not exactly the same thing.

Regards -- TAM

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Troy....

I suspect that is how the roll cast got its name in the first place.  Rolling (or really, unrolling) the loop thus formed on the water.

As you probably know, Joan Wulff teaches new students to do an on-the-water-roll cast as the first task.  She does this for two reasons. 1. It is easy, thus yielding a bit of instant success which is encouraging to the beginner.   2. It can be done with no dynamic back cast.

A wet fly can be cast using either an on-the-water roll cast or an in-the-air (aereolized) roll cast.  Same with a dry fly. However, I do know what you mean.

Just another good way of looking at it.

Lefty likes to look at most casting as, "unrolling a loop to a target".  I like that concept, too.  This concept can lead to smoother casting than when the student looks at it as, "throwing" to a target.

All of the casts you describe, above, are variations on a theme.  Flipping lots of line behind the caster is just one way of gaining more load from behind when you don't have enough in front ....... as when casting on a waxed gym floor.  It can help get more distance when fishing, too..... if you have room to use it behind you.  Most often not needed in the real world of fishing, especially when you can exercise the options of adding a haul, gaining greater stroke length and rod arc by starting the forward stroke with the rod tip way back behind you,  using the, "dynamic" roll cast ("switch cast") or, "all of the above".

When I pointed out the, "roll" of the tip, I meant that this is the way some students look at it.  Definitely incorrect if you wish a small loop ....... but might have contributed to the name.

Gordy

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Here is how Craig Buckbee looks at the roll cast:-

gordy,

here's my take on the roll cast, and the gray area surrounding it's name...

I visualize the D-loop of line in the set-up position and how at the start of the forward stroke it is pulled, lifted, rolled forward off the water by the rod tip. i see that as the actual roll of the roll cast, not the cliched hoop of line out front rolling away from the caster.

in other words, it's how we pick the line up, off the surface. the presentation is made by a forward stroke... well powered to overcome inertia.

the role of the roll.

craig

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Craig ....   I don't know who first named this cast or exactly what he or she had in mind.  Your guess is as good as mine.

 

Gordy

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I just got back last night from my trip to New Jersey.

Lefty, Jim Valle and I gave public demo's of fly casting on Saturday after spending the previous day setting up the new Lefty Kreh Challenge Casting Course on the pond behind the L&H Woods & Waters shop in Wall, N.J.

This course consists of a series of 18 targets set at strategic positions in the water.  Each target has an associated position where the caster must stand.  Some are casts of moderate difficulty.  Some require a lot of expertise (targets around corners, under tree branches or with lots of brush nearby ..... some with no back cast room, one at long distance, etc.)

Jim and I made the rounds to make sure that between the two of us we could actually make the casts, although some requiring multiple attempts.

At noon, Lefty cut the ribbon opening the course.  This will be kept as a course available to individuals, groups or casting clubs. A point system is printed on a score card.

Sunday, Jim and I gave an MCCI prep course to some promising candidates.

Gordy

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From Al Crise:-

Howdy FFF MEMBERS and CCIs

There is a site on the FFF web page if you look real hard you can find it to pay your Dues or pay for your testing.

it is http://www.fedflyfishers.org/Default.aspx?tabid=4780  Bookd mark this for your date.

 

I had to have Barbara find it for me.

 

ol Al
--
Allen Crise
FFF Master Casting Instructor
Glen Rose TX
254-897-2045 h
254-396-1574 c

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