RE: Had an interesting day today

Walter....

Your questions offer great teaching / coaching material. Note my answers in BOLD CAPS in your text, below.

                                                                   Gordy

 

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From: Walter Simbirski <simbirsw@xxxxxxx>
To: Gordon Hill <hillshead@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Had an interesting day today
Date: Sat, 04 Feb 2006 01:28:51 -0700

Gordy - We have the annual Western Canada Fly Fishing Expo in Calgary this weekend. I'm

not sure why they do a fly fishing show in Calgary in February but it is quite a good show.

 

Spent a few minutes with Tim Rajeff on my cast. His comment to me on tracking was that

it is okay to start the cast with the arm away from the body rather than close in (i.e. elbow

close to the side) - especially in an open stance. Another quantum leap for me. I've had

quite a few people (some MCI's) tell me that this is wrong because it makes for a weak

stroke. I find this interesting because we often talk about how little power is actually

required and yet so many people will discourage a student from using certain styles

because of potential power losses. The grip is an extremely good example - many instructors

discourage a student from using anything but the thumb on top grip (very few FFF trained

instructors but I do see the occassional one).

 

TIM IS 100% CORRECT !  TO PROVE IT TO YOURSELF, USE A CASTING SETUP LIKE THIS:  PLACE A HI VIZ ROPE STRETCHED OUT ON THE GRASS, MEASURING ABOUT TWICE THE DISTANCE OF YOUR CAST.  NOW STAND ABOUT ONE ROD LENGTH TO ONE SIDE OF IT WITH THE ROD TIP CLOSE TO THE ROPE, AT ABOUT ITS MIDDLE.  USE A HORIZONTAL ROD PLANE, AND TRY TO PLACE YOUR LOOPS CENTERED ALONG THE ROPE.

 

YOU WILL NOTE THAT AS YOU INCREASE THE LENGTH OF YOUR CAST, THAT YOU HAVE TO GET YOUR ARM AND ELBOW OUT FARTHER FROM YOUR BODY NEAR THE CONCLUSION OF EACH STROKE....BACK STROKE AND FORWARD STROKE.  AS YOU FALSE CAST THIS WAY, KEEPING YOUR LOOP RIGHT OVER THE ROPE, YOU WILL NOTE THAT AS YOU START EACH NEW STROKE, YOU DO SO WITH YOUR ARM AND ELBOW OUT.....THEN BRING THE ELBOW BACK TOWARD YOUR RIBS AT MID STROKE, AND BACK OUT AGAIN AS YOU COMPLETE YOUR STROKE.

......NOW TILT THE WHOLE MECHANISM TO OFF VERTICAL AND DO THE SAME THING.  NEXT, KEEP DOING EXACTLY THE SAME THING, EXCEPT GO TO AN ALMOST VERTICAL ROD PLANE.  YOU ARE NOW CASTING THE WAY TIM SHOWED YOU.....BUT HAVE PROVEN THE POINT TO YOURSELF !!!!  (ONE CAVEAT IS THAT AS YOU GO TO A STRICTLY VERTICAL ROD PLANE, THAT ELBOW TRAVEL IS MORE DOWNWARD THAT IN TO YOUR RIBS.)

 

(I FIRST SAW THIS TEACHING TRICK USED BY LEFTY KREH.  THEN FLOYD FRANKE SHOWED IT TO ME AGAIN USING A SECOND HI VIZ FLY LINE PLACED ON THE GROUND AND STRETCHED TIGHT.)

 

Next was a chance to try the Sage casting analyzer. The results were a bit of a

surprise to me - 100% symmetry on the front and back cast. Stops on both front

and back that were quicker (almost double for the front cast) than their expert caster

comparison. Excessive power (very excessive) on the stroke and some excess arc.

Also my smoothness needs work. I'm thinking that the excessive power could

be one of the root causes of both the excess arc and lack of smoothness since it

can be difficult to control these when too much power is being applied. This is a

very enlightening little device. Nothing can replace practice but it sure can help in

identifying where practice needs to be concentrated. I hope to spend some time

working on what I've learned tomorrow (today) and then try it again on Sunday while I

have the opportunity.  ERRATIC, OR MISPLACED POWER IS OFTEN THE PROBLEM. THE TRUE EXPERT DISTANCE CASTER CAN AND DOES APPLY TREMENDOUS POWER......BUT HE ONLY ADDS THAT TO AN OTHERWISE PERFECT CAST.   ED JOWOROWSKI TAUGHT ME TO SMOOTH OUT THE STROKE BY FALSE CASTING WITH A COMFORTABLE AMOUNT OF LINE OUT OF THE ROD......THEN TRY TO MAKE THE SAME NICE TIGHT LOOPS WITH A BIT LESS POWER, CONCENTRATING ON A CRISP STOP AND, "STARTING SLOW AND ENDING FASTER."   NOW KEEP TRYING TO KEEP THOSE LOOPS TIGHT AND PARALLEL LOOP ARMS WHILE USING LESS AND LESS POWER.........SLOWER AND SLOWER, UNTIL YOU CAN'T KEEP THE LINE ALOFT.  AT THAT POINT, INCREASE YOUR TIP SPEED SLIGHTLY......AND NOTE THE SMOOTHNESS OF YOUR CAST IMPROVE.

 

NOW THAT YOU HAVE BECOME SUPER SMOOTH WITH A SLOW ROD TIP SPEED AND SLOW LOOP SPEED, TAKE A PAGE FROM BILL GAMMEL'S TEACHING, AND TRY TO KEEP THAT WELL LEARNED SMOOTHNESS AND TIGHT LOOP AS YOU CAST WITH ONLY ABOUT 30' TO 35' OF LINE, AND MAKE IT FASTER AND FASTER UNTIL YOU HAVE MAX LOOP SPEED WITHOUT LOSING PERFECTION.  ADD A LITTLE MORE LINE AND GO THROUGH THE SAME DRILL.  KEEP DOING THAT UNTIL YOU CAN'T KEEP THAT PERFECT LOOP AND FEEL THAT YOU ARE GETTING A BIT OUT OF CONTROL.  BACK OFF ON USING THAT AMOUNT OF LINE UNTIL YOU CAN DO IT WITH REPETATIVE FALSE CASTING AT HIGH SPEED.  YOU HAVE JUST FOUND THE AMOUNT OF LINE THAT YOU CAN CARRY. 

 

Quick question for you - when someone says to demonstrate a cast with 40 feet of line

I think of that as 40 feet of flyline plus the leader outside of the tip. For the Sage casting

analyzer it appears that 40 feet means the combination of leader plus line outside of the tip

plus rod length equals 40 feet. This is one item I can't recall from the test - when demonstrating

casts at 35' - 40' does that mean 28'-33' of flyline outside the tip (assuming the extra 7'

feet is the leader) or 18'-24' of flyline outside of the rod tip (assuming 9 feet for the rod)?

As near as I can recall it was the 28'-33' (which would make sense because this would

be roughly 30' - the amount needed to match the rod weight)

 

CORRECT.  THE TASK, "DEMONSTRATE A --------- CAST AT 40' MEANS JUST THAT.  THE FLY LANDS ON A REAL OR IMAGINARY TARGET AT 40' FROM THE CASTER.

 

NOW WHEN AN EXAMINER ASKS YOU TO MAKE FALSE CASTS WITH 40' OF LINE, HE'S USUALLY ASKING FOR A REASONABLE APPROXIMATION.....NOT A CAREFUL MEASUREMENT.

 

JOAN WULFF AND MANY OTHERS MARK FLY LINES FROM THE LEADER CONNECTION TO THE DISTANCE MARK.  THEN, TO CALCULATE THE DISTANCE OF THE CAST, THE LENGTH OF THE LEADER AND THE ROD IS ADDED. (READ P 116 OF JOANS BOOK, "FLY CASTING TECHNIQUES"

THIS IS A PRACTICAL WAY OF FIGURING THE LENGTH OF YOUR CAST WHILE FISHING....BUT NO WHERE NEAR AS ACCURATE AS THE MEASURED DISTANCE BETWEN THE CASTER AND A TARGET ON THE GRASS, UNLESS THE CAST RESULTS IN AN ABSOLUTELY STRAIGHT LINE AND LEADER LAYOUT.

 

FOR THIS REASON, WHEN JUDGING YOUR OWN DISTANCE, IT'S BEST TO USE THE LATTER METHOD.

 

TO PROVE THIS, MAKE A CAST, PLACING THE FLY ON A TARGET 75' FROM YOU.  NOW LOOK AT THE MARKS ON YOUR FLY LINE.  YOU MAY WELL BE OUT AT THE 85' MARK.........(BUT YOU DIDN'T CAST THAT FAR AT ALL. )

 

                                                        GORDY

 

Thanks Gordy

 

Walter