Task 17 Discussion 12

Gordy, here is what has worked for me. I have tied my own leaders for years and unless conditions (fresh water) are very mossy, I think it is the best way to go.

1. I don't think that length is critical for bones although I would not use anything shorter than 7.5 feet. I believe that a person is best served by using the same length leader as much as possible. I like 9 feet because it works well for almost anything and there is plenty of room to tie in 5 or 6 sections if I want. As far as bonefish are concerned, you can be fishing to schools of fish or to singles/pairs. If it is a school the most important thing is not to cast over or into the fish, if your cast is in the right place you could almost use a logging chain with a tippet and fly. If you are hunting the singles, I would have at least 2 feet of fluorocarbon for a tippet. A good presentation is important.

2. As far as taper is concerned, I will stay close to the 60/20/20 formula. My butt section will be close to 5 feet of 40 lb. Maxima Chameleon, followed by a foot of 30 and 20 lb. and 2 feet of 10 lb. flouro. The flouro strong for diameter, less visible and sinks quicker than mono. In ultra clear water you may have to switch from the Chameleon to a clear leader or add in more flouro.

4. I change leaders often so I use loop to loop for line to leader, this is usually a perfection loop at the butt end, I use blood knots for the rest of the leader sections and a triple surgeon's for flouro to mono. All my knots are treated with Knot-Sense, a UV cure glue. Knot failure is not an option.

If I may; I have a non related question. Is a pile cast a cast or a mend? It is very similar to a reach mend in that it is a repositioning of the line after the loop has formed, just in a different plane.

1. You and I are basically in agreement on the length and design of bonefish leaders, in general. Most bone fishers choose far longer leaders. I would, also, for spooky tailing fish tailing in very shallow water on a calm day. Here, I would go to a 12' or even a 15' leader.

I'd reserve my short leaders for very windy days when casting is difficult and the fish are not spooky. This is one answer to Peter Morse's request for discussion on leaders to best handle strong winds : -

Gordy I haven't seen any discussion on modifying leaders to deal with inclement conditions. When teaching a class on casting in the wind and dealing with the wind this is the first thing I discuss, its one of things we can adjust to give us more control BEFORE we even step onto the water or up onto the casting deck. Its something candidates will possibly be grilled on in the oral component but I think its always wise to start with a comment on altering leader.

I do understand what you mean by a heavy splash down as with a forceful presentation with a heavy line not being much of a problem if you place it correctly..... usually meaning presenting way ahead of moving fish. Often, however, I don't have that luxury, so to avoid spooking, I use as light an outfit as I can for the casting conditions.

2. For most situations, I use that same 60-20-20 formula. On windy days, I'll go to a 50 lb. butt section and then taper down aggressively to a 10 lb. to 12 lb. tippet for large bones. 6# - 4# for small ones.

3. I'd rather rely on the use of mass profile than relative stiffness to turn over my leader in heavy winds .... so I use moderately flexible nylon monofilament except for my tippet of FC (fluorocarbon). (On very windy days, the fish seem to take just as well whether I use the FC or not).

4. I also use blood knots between segments. I don't use the perfection loop for the butt section only because it results in a loop which won't close down much in the loop to loop connection with the fly line whereas the non-slip loop does yield a bit less wind resistance and the tag end is less likely to catch weed. The least wind resistance, I've found, is with the 6X Uni (Duncan Loop) which pulls down flat on tension then remains straight. Not as strong as either the perfection or non-slip loops, but that doesn't matter when used with 40# or 50# material.

# Short leaders work better. When I need to use them for heavy wind conditions, I also use a line with a clear intermediate sink tip. That way the end of the fly line acts a lot like an extension of the proximal end of the leader.

# Leaders with mass distribution such that the densities of the segments rapidly diminish as we go from Butt section to Tippet turn over better and yield smaller leader loops than those with stiff material without the aggressive mass/dia. ratios when casting in heavy winds.

When you add the dropping of the rod ("rod fade") after the cast and you in any way pull some of the line down or reposition the line in any other direction, this is a MEND.

[GH] Yesterday, I bounced Peter Morse's question right back at him, feeling confident that he knew the answers well. Turns out, I was right about that. I like his method of answering with a "Quick answer" (short ans.) followed by a "Long Answer". That would be great practice for Master Candidates :

Quick answer - A normal bonefish leader for me is around 12 feet long including a 10lb. fluorocarbon tippet and would consist of a 60/20/20 makeup. On a windy day I would rig a leader shorter and thicker overall (not necessarily stiffer), around 10 feet total.

Long answer. Because of the wind delicate presentations are not going to be required, the waves and noise will mask any rough touchdowns. I tie my own leaders so would still go to a 60/20/20 leader. Using a micrometer I remove the level section at the front of most fly lines, especially those lines where accuracy and delicacy are concerned. I like the butt section meeting the front of the front taper and I join it with a 5 turn nail knot. I would be aiming to get my fly closer to the fish so I would be looking for a lighter fly which will also help with casting in the conditions - but depth and current, as well as the mood of the fish is also a consideration - (are they traveling, are they feeding, are they tailing)???.

My butt section would consist of 6 feet of approx. 45lb. mono double blood knotted to 1 foot of 30lb. to 1 foot of 20lb. (I really like Maxima for its medium stiffness) then a triple turn surgeons knot to 2-3 feet of 15lb. fluorocarbon.

Technically I suspect you really mean that you'd want, for wind casting, a leader the material for which was denser rather than stiffer. When directed into the wind at the same velocity, that increased mass out performs stiffer/lighter material, despite the fact that as we go to higher lb. test material we have to accept some increased diameter to gain that additional mass. Up to a point, this is a good trade-off.

Gary Eaton used different words to make that same point a few messages ago with respect to fly lines. From a performance standpoint (unless talking about slack line leaders), the leader can be considered a distal extension of the fly line.

With the new high density (sinking) leader materials, we could come closer to greater efficiency for casting in high winds, though I must admit I have not tried these sink leaders with an eye to wind casting.

Years ago, I used to think (and taught) that the most important consideration when choosing leader materials was relative stiffness. This despite Lefty Kreh demonstrating that very stiff leaders resist tight loop turnovers. Then Bruce Richards and a couple of our physicists beat it out of me making me go and do some experiments of my own. They were right about the mass distribution being much more important . I was wrong !

I think Lefty put it well in common language : "For years we've been told that we should use stiff material in the butt section. I believe this to be totally wrong. When your rod sweeps forward and stops, the line behind you begins unrolling from the tip. Gradually the line unrolls until it arrives at the leader - which must also unroll to deliver the fly. Common sense should tell you that if a supple fly line unrolls and arrives at the leader, a stiff butt section is going to resist unrolling. What you really need is enough SUPPLE WEIGHT in the butt section to cause the leader to continue to unroll."